The Denon AVR-X8500H has the same AKM AK4490EQ 192kHz, 32-bit DAC as the AVR-X7200WA – and that’s where the similarities end.
The build quality of the AVR-X8500H seems a bit more polished, with a noticeably reinforced top panel and solid aluminum front panel. It’s about ~2″ deeper, but wasn’t a problem for my media console. It is substantially heavier though – you should get one of those Audioholic guys to help.
As far as design, in order to process 13.2-channels, it has to use two ADI Griffin Lite DSPs. There are eight discrete stereo 32-bit DA converters at work. Also with Denon’s Advanced AL32 processing, all signals are upconverted to 32-bits.
And of equal importance, there’s also a larger, proprietary transformer and a straight signal path to the amplification stage. This means beefier heatsinks and four silent fans – and a presumably more transparent output.
I actually went through the trouble of swapping in and out the two receivers over the course of a few weeks. The connections were very similar between the two so it took less than 3 minutes to swap.
The first thing you’ll notice is how much more intelligible and focused the dialogue is with the AVR-X8500H. You’re able to decipher every word – no matter how busy the soundtrack gets. In comparison, the AVR-X7200WA sounds warmer but slighted muddied and mumbled.
As far as tonality, the AVR-X7200WA has a warmer tone. The AVR-X8500H sides more on clean and neutral. The AVR-X7200WA is also a bit thicker and more “generalized” in its overtones. It relays a more intimate atmosphere rather than the spacious, well-delineated one of the AVR-X8500H.
The AVR-X7200WA does miss out on a bit of useful resolution. I think this resolution helps relay more lifelike details in a person’s voice or special effects – making them more believable (and refreshing) on the AVR-X8500H.
You then start to realize how quiet and transparent the AVR-X8500H is in comparison. It seems to lift a few veils off of the mix, allowing you to hear the finer and more granular bits. This results in a much more accurate articulation of the sound field, especially with the immersive formats. It’s much easier to hear how the engineers moved the sound objects around the listening space. With the AVR-X7200WA, there’s more “bleeding of the lines” and directionality is more vague.
Although both AVRs sport 150 watts per channel into 8 ohms, the AVR-X8500H has more dynamic presence. Explosions and rapid cross-room effects have more texture and reach further into the room – with more authority. The AVR-X7200WA is a bit tamer and doesn’t extrude into space as confidently. Dynamics are a bit softer as well. It just feels like the AVR-X8500H has more juice and top/bottom extension. You feel more of the sound.
From an immersion perspective. I didn’t really think the addition of the two front heights would make much of a difference.
I was wrong.
Although I did feel the void between the front height to the listening seat with the AVR-X7200WA (9.1.2), I didn’t think I was missing out on any critical information.
What those extra two height speakers provide is a much better sense of scale and weight. It gave monsters stomping upstairs a much more accurate sense of size and shape. Fighter jets that zoom past your head have a more realistic wingspan. Rain sounds like it blankets with more palpability and delicacy. Going back to the AVR-X7200WA, the sonic gap becomes obvious – as well as the substantial loss of dimensional cues.
In short, once you’ve experienced 9.2.4, it’s difficult to go back.
The AVR-X7200WA is a very fine piece of gear. If you’re maxed out at 11 channels, you’d be fine with the AVR-X7200WA with external amps. However, if you could manage two more height speakers (or wides), I personally would upgrade to the AVR-X8500H. The continuity it provides in respect to immersion is undeniable and takes the enjoyment of film up more than a few notches.
With 4 extra channels of amplification, if you want a one-box solution, that’s another good reason to go with the AVR-X8500H.
Lastly, if you’re yearning for a more neutral tone, better resolution, transparency, soundstage, and more dynamic prowess – the AVR-X8500H is your ticket. The AVR-X7200WA uses broader, coarser strokes whereas the AVR-X8500H draws with a finer tip. Some of those details you just won’t get with the AVR-X7200WA – no matter what you do.
The choice is yours.
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I've been enjoying your site for some time now. I really enjoyed your video coverage of what I think was rmaf. Can I ask you to make some comparison of the sound quality to two channel electronics? I see that the AVR-X8500H is 4,000$. Without out holding you to any complicated analysis can you approximate what price range you'd be in to have a comparable sound quality from any known two channel set up?
thanks for your time..
Ben.
Hey Ben,
If you're talking about getting something close to the AVR-X8500H for stereo, the NuForce STA200 is great choice and is only $500. As you've probably guessed, amplifiers all have their own character. It depends on what you're trying to do for your system. If you're looking to warm things up, the Benchmark AHB2 is fantastic. If you prefer more balance with a touch more shine, perhaps the Chord TToby. If you're looking for something silky and smooth, the First Watts are nice. I personally wouldn't buy an amplifier until I was able to audition it for a few days at least. Many of these dealers allow in-home auditions so that's the route I would go.
Best,
Jay
Hi Jay,
Great article. I am looking to install a system similar to yours but don't have enough time or talent to want to do it myself. Can you recommend a professional/dealers in Los Angeles that can do the installation of such a system and set-up. I will be working with an empty room since this will be in a house to be ready by summer.
Thanks !
This is not really a fair comparison.
The 7200 costs around 50-60% of what an 8500 currently costs. So, I hope indeed the 8500 is better than the 7200, but for me personally if the sonic differences are so subtle, I wouldn't upgrade to the 8500 as a sound upgrade.
Sonic differences aren't subtle. The 8500 is cleaner and more resolving while the 7200 is warmer and cozier. If you don't need 13 channels, it comes down to preference.
Thank you for an incredibly detailed and painstaking review.
I own a Denon AVC-A1HDA which has stopped working; and the local Denon service centre is finding it difficult to repair. It is a superb-sounding amplifier and I dont need more than 7 channels, so should I replace it with the 8500H? How do they compare sonically? Also, have you heard the new Rotel multi-channel amp/receiver?
8500H = quieter and more detailed. More spatial clarity and transparency. TBH, the 7200 sounds great out of the box - warmer, denser, but less resolving. Unless you prioritize resolution - the 7200 may actually work fine for you.
Hey Jay! great review! I was curious how the preamp performed? I'm coming from a Marantz 7703 and want to add some front wides, my plan, use the 8500H onboard amp to run the front and the pre outs to my outlaw amps to complete the 11.2.
Thank you, Todd! At one point, I ran the front height preamps to an old Audio Source amp and rears to a wireless Rockfish box. Works flawlessly with no issues. I didn't do any hardcore A/B, but it sounded cleaner and more resolving than the 7200 as a preamp. I LOVE the flexibility of the 85000H. Which Outlaw amps do you have?
I have 2 Outlaw 5000, I was seriously thinking of the Marantz 8805, however the Denon would allow me to expand to 13.2 without buying additional amps :-) I figure with the 2 HSU VTF-15H MK2 s things should integrate well.
Very nice amps! Great choice on the HSUs. I think having 13 channels of processing with amplification in a relatively small package - is simply unbeatable. Not just for smaller spaces, but for the potential headaches that come with having too many amps. If you have a much larger space - then the Marantz AV8805 probably makes a lot more sense.
I'm pretty hardcore, but practical, about my home theater. As long as the gear doesn't take away from the experience. I'm good with that. Changing out the power cord adds that bit of warmth to the clarity on the AVR-X8500H - and I'm loving it.
Unfortunately, the audiophile world is very different. lol.
Thanks for the great feedback! I'm gonna be one of those guys who's going to question the power cable difference but now i'm curious, what cable would you recommend and is there anything reasonable priced? lol FYI my room is roughly
18X13 with a 12' ceiling that slopes a bit, the 8500H will be here on Monday :-)
That's a decent sized room for sure. I totally get it. I used to be so cynical about cables - but heard them for myself.
Hm, I think the Vovox Textura is pretty good. It masks some of the detail but does provide warmth. I'm actually using a DIY'ed Furutech DPS-4. You could use cheaper connectors and I think it complements the sound well. I'm working on a DIY project with the Neotech NEP-3200 wire. https://www.vhaudio.com/wire.html#neotechpower
Yeah, that should be fine. Even when I'm driving 13 speakers, I don't think I draw more than 6 amps from the entire system (with TV, oppo, etc). Obviously, it depends if you're satisfied with the output. P=IV means ~2,200-2,400 watts of power.
I do have one more question regarding power, I have the 2 5 channel Outlaws on a dedicated 20amp outlet, ( 9 channels used with everything crossed over at 80Hz) could I add the Denon to the same outlet without an issue? I would only be using 2 channels to power the front wides. Thanks again for your help!
Thanks for all the input and help Jay! who knows you may turn me into a cable snob soon enough!
Hey Jay! I am so unsure of what settings to use for both video and to get the best sound quality as possible when Playing some movies.. Do you have a guide or know one that I could use? Just got it, and have a Dali Rubicon 5.1 at the moment
Great sounding (and looking) speakers. I preferred to have a warmer sound so I use the Furutech DPS-1 on the AVR-X8500H. If you prefer a transparent and detailed sound - it's great out of box with just the basic mic setup.
Is the rotel 1585 be a good match with the Devon?
When using a power amp are you able to shut off the 5 internal amp LCR Surround and use the Denon internal amp for the rest of the speaker?